Spurs ‘can step in and dominate’ as fans demand credit for seventh-best club

Spurs fans say that Spurs deserve loads more credit for moving into seventh, while we also have views on Arsenal and Man Utd.

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Give some credit to Spurs and ‘elite’ Ange management
Since Matt and the #lads and Sarah at F365 didn’t put Spurs in the winners section once again, instead of moaning about it, here you go:

Winners: Ange Postecoglou and Spurs

After suffering a deeply scarring and morale-sapping loss away to Crystal Palace last Sunday, the stage was set for more pressure to be piled on useless, fat George Michael lookalike Ange Postecoglou and his peak Spursy Spurs side whose form has been more up and down than James Corden’s cholesterol.

Facing them were two potentially season defining games against “top, top quality opposition” (to quote Harry Redknapp) within the space of the week. Lose both, and Spurs would’ve been out of the one competition they can most realistically win, and cut adrift to 4th in the table by 8 points.

First up was an old-fashioned knockout tie under the lights against Manchester City in the League Cup, a game that felt particularly significant for a club embroiled in a existential trophy drought and having come off the back of a quite dreadful performance at Selhurst Park.

By Thursday morning, Spurs had successfully negated the challenge, inflicting the first defeat of the season on the City juggernaut. Admittedly, Pep did not choose – nor need – to risk all of his first-team players. But for Spurs, this was a significant opportunity to step 3 games closer to winning actual, real life silverware.

Ange duly obliged by selecting his strongest team available, watching his side successfully manage an early 2 goal lead to make it through to the quarter final (despite an early injury to talismanic defender Micky Van De Ven and no Heung Min Son to customary slay City).

But with top table challengers Villa to come just 4 days later, the question come Sunday kick off was: at what cost? Villa had chosen to rest key players midweek (and were duly despatched by a resurgent Palace provided life saving CPR by Dr Tottenham – you’re welcome), and arrived in North London with a fully fit squad and unbeaten away record.

Throw in the momentum of an extraordinarily strong start in the Champions League, victory in their last two visits to the Tottenham Hotspur Stadium under Unai Emery, and Spurs’ topsy turvy season so far, you’d be forgiven for thinking the omens didn’t look good for Ange’s Spurs.

This sense that a Villa victory was inevitable given the circumstances was then only heightened in a first half where Spurs looked – unsurprisingly – lethargic and fatigued from Thursday. Then in the 32nd minute, Spurs exhibited a mental fragility which has had the doubters rubbing their hands with glee all season.

A Villa corner, obligingly scored as the result of a defence seemingly incapable of exerting any real protection around a visibly uneasy Vicario, leading to a Keystone Kops style goalmouth scramble with the Italian flapping at the ball, bouncing off a Bentancur’s head back towards the goal line and being tapped home by Morgan Rogers. 1-0 to Unai’s Villa, who appeared to have Spurs’ number. Ignore the fact that was only the 2nd goal Spurs have conceded off a set piece this season: the narrative after last season has already been set.

Football writers around the land sharpened their pencils at half time, duly ready to regurgitate all the same narratives about Ange having no plan B, typical Spursy Spurs, bottling it when it matters.

What followed after half time can only be described as elite management. First, whatever words were said in the changing room, Spurs players came back on the pitch visibily re-energised and focused. A few minutes later, it was 1-1 from a un-defendable cross from captain Son who stopped trying to cut inside like he was doing in the first half and was likely told to be more direct when space opened up.

Second, what then ensued seemed at first to be a nonsensical, potentially suicidal decision from Ange to take off Son and Bentancur, for Richarlison and Bissouma. Less than 15 minutes later, Spurs were 3-1 up, including an assist from Richarlison. The additional fresh legs in midfield and direct physical running down the left bamboozled Villa, allowing Spurs to continue to press high and force turnovers, leading to both the game-defining goals. Scored by a striker willing to cover ever blade of grass for his team and his manager.

By full time, it had become a rout. Aston Villa’s biggest defeat under Emery since they last played Ange’s Spurs in March. A game where Spurs had not gone full throttle first half, and with Ange boldly making changes, rope-a-doped a Villa side simply not ready for the level of intensity second half. The effects of Angeball on show once again. Leaving Spurs just 2 points behind title chasers Arsenal and Aston Villa (instead of an unbridgeable 8 point gap), building a formidable record at home, becoming the highest scorers in the league, and now left with precise mental clarity around what needs improving: their away form. With 3/4 of the season left to achieve it.
Greg Linton

…Long-time reader of at least 20 years. I used to love to pour over the site, the interviews, the articles, the Neville Diaries, Look Alikes. Informative and funny.

The articles and match reports were insightful, articulate, mature. Serious and talented football journalists who could make me laugh.

The quality of writing has sadly dropped significantly, and there is barely an original article or match report worth reading

It’s become a series of knee jerk lists with clear bias and narratives. The fascination with manager sack lists for example is childish at best, malevolent at worst. I honestly think it’s an attempt to create traction to get someone sacked. Gutter journalism to hide a lack of talent.

Not a Spurs fan, but an Australian. Last season Ange was a breath of fresh air. This season he’s lucky to be in a job. Apparently. 9 wins out of 11. 2 big come from behind wins in 3 games. When they lose the other side were excellent, their manager talented, but when Spurs win the focus is on how poor the opponent was, how the manager f***ed up. Zero credit for the Spurs manager or the team. Doesn’t fit the latest narrative.

Two thumping 4-1 wins, one against the darling Villa and much vaunted manager. Neither result got the team or manager in the Winners side of Winners and Losers! Lose and its straight into the Losers and up the sack rankings.

Shockingly poor journalism. There is a clear bias. At least acknowledge that.

Bring back the quality writing and the humour. It used to be an hilarious read. Now it’s “You’ll never guess which 6 Real Madrid players are still playing”. Such a fall from grace.

Lift your game you f**kers.
Fadida, Australia
PS. Apparently you only print what you receive. You’ve received this.

(We did indeed. And we remain amused after decades that people expect Winners and Losers to be a list of the teams that win and lost over the weekend. What you are looking for there is a list of results. We literally described Tottenham as having ‘very possibly the most rounded midfield department the Premier League can currently offer’ – Ed)

Timing is on Tottenham’s side
The history of the Premier League has been littered with fortunate pieces of timing. Alex Ferguson joining Man Utd just before the formation of the Premier League, Abramovic buying Chelsea just as the so called Invincibles were being broken up, Pep joining City after Ferguson retired etc. Each of these convenient pieces of timing led to a period of domination for the clubs in question. I mention this because I feel that timing could be on Spurs’ side over the next five to ten years.

As we all know, Pep’s contract at City is set to expire at the end of the 24/25 season, and he’d only be willing to extend for one extra year if he does stay in at all. So if for some reason City are not relegated from the Premier League over their rampant cheating, their domination is only guaranteed for another season or so, leaving the door open for another club to step in and dominate. Spurs are in a better position than anybody to be that club.

Firstly, we have the infrastructure. The fact that we have the highest matchday revenues in Europe is well documented by now, and the building of the Tottenham Hotspur stadium has guaranteed we will remain a financial powerhouse for the foreseeable future.

Secondly, we have the manager. As I explained in my recent mail, a team does not sit at the top of the XGF table if it isn’t heading in the right direction, and we are playing some of the most exciting football in Europe. The recent wins over City and Villa show we are starting to turn that domination into results.

Thirdly, we have the squad. Romero, Van De Ven, Udogie, Vicario, Bentancur, Kulusevski, Porro are all set to hit their primes in the coming years.

I believe Big Ange and Daniel have spotted this opportunity too, and this is why they’ve invested so heavily in youth. The likes of Johnson, Bergvall, Gray and Oderbert have all been signed with an eye on the future. All highly talented players who will be fully fledged first teamers by the time Pep leaves.

Another factor to consider is our rivals. Arsenal have already peaked under Arteta, and Edu is leaving. They got their timing ever so slightly wrong. Same goes for Liverpool, who unfortunately timed the appointment of Klopp with Pep’s era of dominance with City. Man Utd are the banter club that keeps on giving, and Chelsea remain a mess with FFP punishments surely on the horizon.

Us Spurs fans have waited very patiently for an opportunity like this. Timing might finally be on our side.
Barry Fox

What are Spurs?
Tottenham. What a club, eh?

Thing is, I often get called a Gooner around these parts but genuinely, if anything, when it comes to the elite game in this country I am a North London supporter. Not really of course, that statement is stupid beyond all recognition but the fact is, Spurs are a club I actually love in so many ways – their fans are contradictorily some of the most entitled and self-deprecating all at once, they have often (even at their worst) played entertaining football and (showing a bit of Gooner love here too) they are one half of what I genuinely believe to be, pound-for-pound, the best rivalry in world football.

A derby that always entertains, aggro enough that there’s genuine spice, but not so aggro that lives are in danger. Perfect.

However I am at a loss, where are Tottenham, right now? Really?

In their Sophomore season with Ange Postecoglou, they remain as blissfully inconsistent as they ever have – yet when I watch them, they feel really good. Like, “actually could win a trophy, maybe even two” good? Yet merely a week ago they lost to Palace – a team that hadn’t so much as sniffed three points in 3 months.

I hear the comments on Vicario on Sky Sports, but honestly, that feels like narrative to me and he remains an exciting keeper with a weakness that sometimes gets exposed, just like many keepers in the league, their back 4 have “could individually all play for Champions League contenders” written all over them. When they are on it, they have one of the most resilient AND creative midfields in the league (I’d imagine Liverpool and Arsenal -if not necessarily jealous of the individual players -wouldn’t sniff at their depth in that area) and when Richarlison is the weakest of your forward line, you have a pretty stacked forward line.

Rewind 18 months, and the jury was out on Ange Postecoglou and whether he was the right appointment but would any Spurs fan have sniffed at 6th in November of his 2nd season, with a very real possibility of being in the Champions League conversation come the end of the season – playing exciting football and making a quarter final of a league cup that is genuinely winnable for them?

However, the nagging feeling that they could drop points at home to Ipswich prevails and honestly, that in itself is wonderful… what club in this country could you genuinely not be surprised to see lose to Palace, beat City and Villa in two competitions, then drop points to Ipswich only to go and take something off City?

I can see this Tottenham doing something, y’know… but, much like their cross-town rivals, it requires a spark of resilience and luck to strike at the same time and, you know what, I hope it happens.
Harold Ebenezer Hooler Esq.
(While we’re at it “North London Forever” being sung by your home crowd – when you quite famously haven’t been North London Forever is either blissfully ignorant or a beautiful bit of trolling)

A little Arsenal perspective…
Cards on the table, I’m an Arsenal fan… Sorry…

With that being said:

The Premier League, since it’s inception in the 92-93 season, has been won by a grand total of 11 managers.

Sir Alex Ferguson won 13 of them. Out of 32

So another way of saying it is, “Out of 32 seasons, 19 of them have been won by 10 managers.”

Señor Pep Guardiola won 6 of those.

So another way of saying it is, “Out of 32 seasons, 13 of them have been won by 9 managers.”

Monsieur Arsene Wenger and Senhor José Mourinho each won three of those.

So another way of saying it is, “Out of 32 seasons, 25 of them were won by the 4 best managers the league has ever seen, the other 7 were won by the next 7 best.”

Mourinho and Wenger were, if you like, the most average ‘best managers ever,’ SAF (hugely) and Pep are above average, the rest, Signori Conte, Ancelotti, Ranieri, Herr Klopp, Mr Dalglish and Señores Pellegrini y Mancini are a little below average.

Obviously there are mitigating factors in any emotional argument about who did the best job, but those are the numbers.

Over the last few weeks I’ve heard a lot of mierda being spoken about Señor Mikel Arteta Amatriain. A man less than two years older than me, who’s managed to make Arsenal Arsenal again, in less than 5 years, and keep his first (management) job that whole time.

I manage a burger shop for a mate of mine. It’s a pain in my butt. Like five people in a small tourist town, so much hassle on a daily basis. I could not imagine how much work goes in to managing any professional fútbol club, let alone one the size of Arsenal. The stress any of these guys must go through!

All of this is a long way of saying that I don’t know if Miki is gonna add his name to that pretty prestigious list and become number twelve. Maybe it’s a fight too much for him.

But…

I remember, a few years ago, after 3 games played that season, 0 points and 0 goals for Arsenal, a certain notorious Norf London Gooner saying he hopes Lucas Torreira outlasted Arteta.

I remember, after any semi big game that Arsenal managed to lose, a certain notorious cartoon baby, making semi reasonable points as if he was the first and only person to think them, in the most childish manner possible.

I remember, after utd were linked with Rice, some nameless fan asking if he was really that much better than McTominay.

(I also remember me saying Saka was overrated and would leave Arsenal because ESR would outshine him, none of us are perfect…)

In all that time, AM has transformed Arsenal from a team successively finishing 8th to the most consistent (currently) challenger to the Second Best Manager Our LeagueTM Has Ever Seen.

I don’t care whether he’s the “heir apparent” or Mourinho-lite, I trusted the process in 2021, I think we’re in a much better place now than we were then. Whether or not he ever wins the league, I thank Mikel (and the departing Edu,) for that. The worst you can say is it would be an a lot more attractive place job for top managers if/when he leaves than it was when he took it.
Andy, Guatemala

(Basically, winning the EPL is really tough, especially in the times of Fergie and Pep. Not managing it doesn’t make you shit.)

Are Arsenal fans about to hit reverse?
So if Arsenal fail to beat Chelsea (let alone Forest), and are forced to focus on the much maligned cups this year, just how loud will the reversing beeps on the comments of the last 4 months be?

I say give Arteta an extension. He’s doing a great job.
Badwolf

…Oh dear. It looks like Arsenal are reverting to their post-2004 mean – a top four side that occasionally challenges for the title, may win an FA Cup every so often and is constantly promising jam tomorrow (Wenger’s Youth Project, the Carling Cup wonderkids, the British Core, “wait until FFP kicks in”, “wait until Abramovitch gets bored”, “wait until the stadiums is paid off”, “wait until the next phase” etc, etc, etczzzz).

Just because Arsenal have come close, it doesn’t automatically mean they will go on and win the title this season. Football doesn’t work in a vacuum where you get better and everyone else doesn’t. If it did, Newcastle would have won the league in 1998 and Spurs would have won it 2018.
Matthew

Did Man Utd target a three-at-the-back boss?
I’ve seen conflicting entries to the mailbox over the past week referencing the United’s squad suitability for Amorim’s 3-4-3. We’re either ideally suited or the most 4-2-3-1 team in history. Added to this we’ve had a few interesting takes amounting to ‘only Conte plays three at the back and he’s a dinosaur’.

For what its worth playing with three centre-backs isn’t that uncommon outside of the Premier League.

In terms of recent success we can look to Germany as Alonso guided Leverkusen to an invincible season and Bundesliga title using a 3-4-3 strategy very similar to what Amorim has been playing at Sporting. Beyond those who explicitly play three centre backs many teams use similar strategies whilst attacking. It’s fairly routine to see a team playing a back four push one full back high and keep one back, or both fullbacks high with a deep sitting mid to support the centre backs, both of which effectively create similar structures in possession.

What now seems possible is that this formation, or rather the strategy and philosophy behind it, are what United have targeted in their manager search, not Amorim specifically. It’s been widely reported how United made discreet enquiries with other managers since the INEOS takeover.

As mentioned above Alonso plays three at the back but turned United down seemingly waiting for Ancelotti or Pep to move on, Tuchel too turned United down and has had success in this formation. The long time bookies’ favourite for the United job Gareth Southgate had a great time with England in a more conservative 3-4-3 which was in part orchestrated by Dan Ashworth who seems quite enamoured with this style of play. This isn’t a coincidence, they have been looking for a certain style of play instead of a certain type of man.

This is a positive approach and something which United have sorely lacked. Having a club centric ethos is much better than the pillar to post method of getting whoever is available and restructuring the club around them. The primary reason for United’s wasteful spending over the last ten years was the ignorant belief that a manager knows best and success is achieved by giving that manager whatever they want. Choosing a playing style that will remain consistent then recruiting players and coaches who fit saves so much upheaval and allows the long term stability necessary to achieve long term success.

If Amorim is the one to achieve that success remains to be seen but his successor will likely be quite similar in style and any players signed for Ruben will have to be dynamic enough to be effective for his replacement.
Dave, Manchester

MORE ON MAN UTD FROM F365
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Amorim BS already
There’s already a fair bit of BS being written about United under Amorim and he doesn’t even start for a week. Allow me to retort:

1) the narrative that all our players don’t run is baffling to me because these stats are widely available.

Bruno Fernandes – the man most people like to accuse – was in the upper echelons of Premier League players in terms of distance covered last season.

Dalot is also a fairly athletic player.

Luke Shaw’s problem is not that he doesn’t run but that he’s physically incapable of it usually because he’s injured. I’ll give you Rashford and United were very mid-table for distance covered last season. But Burnley and Everton were near the top of that table so it’s not as simple as saying United will need to run more to move up the table. Can’t hurt though.

Instead I think the focus should be on defensive discipline. Rashford probably can run and will likely try harder for the new manager. But is he disciplined enough to do what the manager wants? And Bruno runs around a lot but is he an effective presser?

2) Amorim is not going to bring players with him. He has signed on at United as the head coach, not the manager. If United are going to sign a whole new squad for every new manager then we’re going to continue wasting money. United may well sign new players to suit his system and some of them may even come from Sporting. But Amorim has no control over this.

He may well have some input but he doesn’t have a veto or the final say. And a manager with such a reputation for improving players should not be relying on bringing in those players to new clubs. See how Arne Slit has Liverpool playing his style of football without signing additional players or bringing in any of his former players. Pep didn’t raid Bayern or Barca when he went to City. If United do sign Sporting players then they must fit the club’s future and not just Amorim’s.

We just can’t afford to be all in on managers the way we have in the past.
Ash Metcalfe